Mom Sparks A Debate If Employees Should Be Treated Differently When It Comes To Time Off Depending On Whether They Have Kids Or Not

I hate when people think they have more dibs than others with holidays.
I used to work every Xmas day and it really annoyed me as I still had family! Just because I didn't have children at the time didnt mean I wanted to spend year after year alone Xmas night.
Now when taking leave I try to be as fair as possible when requesting even though it's kinda my turn to be the asshole

Our holidays are first come, first served, except for school holidays. We have set days to request them by, and they will all be reviewed together. This can be a problem for people who would prefer to book holidays in advance though (like me! I need to confirm with DH and my parents etc) but it does mean that the allocations are fair.
Christmas and New Year are very strictly monitored for fairness because everyone wants time off regardless of kids.

I've never found this to be a problem tbh.The vast majority of child free people I've ever worked with prefer to take holidays outside of peak season - it's far cheaper and less busy.

Over Christmas, most people I've worked with behave like adults and accept rotational cover.

I think the rigid structure of set term times and holidays is just s**t for everyone. Everyone with kids rushing to have a holiday in only certain weeks of the year, with astronomical holiday prices where you’re surrounded by millions of other families and kids. If there was more flexibility for everyone, there would be a lot less competition for holiday approval at work.

YANBU. I think there are 2 issues though - lack of childcare over holidays such as Christmas means a lot of parents would struggle for childcare is one.
The other is specifically with CF colleagues who feel entitled to that time off and kick off about it, which is very different to situations where parents ask if anyone will swap or accept offers from colleagues who are happy to work.

Years ago I was a carer and had my Christmas holiday requests initially approved then taken back because one person kicked off and announced I didn't need time off as I wasn't a mother.
I had been given Christmas shifts for the previous 2 years and when I spoke to bosses I was told they basically asked all parents who was willing to work Christmas Day then put together the rota using any worker who didn't have children to get to the right numbers. I think that was beyond unfair and it resulted in my resignation.

Now my DH is a teacher so we have no choice but to take my leave during school holidays but do a completely different job now (where we close for bank holidays) and there's never been any issues. We work as a team and make a plan together so everything is covered and everyone is pulling their weight.

I agree with this in principle, but I will never book time off over Christmas for this reason, I dont have children! It comes back to the principle of treat others how you wish to be treated, I'd like to think that if I had children I would be able to be there for them, so I personally do my best to allow my colleagues to be there for their children. I do think it comes down to personal preference though.

As someone without children, there always seems to be the tacit assumption I'll work during the school holidays, giving priority to those with kids. To be fair, I don't mind - my commute is easier, work is quieter and enjoy the peace when I holiday when the kids are at school. But I do find it irritating when things like shift patterns, on-call, attendance at certain meetings falls to me because I'm the one who'll be available and won't have to dash off or work around the school run etc. It does feel like you get taken for granted.

I took a position a number of years ago on a 6 month "contract to hire" basis. I was told this was the only way the company hires. OK, fine. Fair treatment for everyone.

The next person they hire is someone that I recommend from my old job. They said the only way they would accept the job if they are directly hired from day 1. Reason being is they have 6 kids and cannot wait the 6 months for health insurance (this is the US). Company agrees to it.

I ended up doing the math for what I "gave up" by doing the 6 month contract and it was well over $10,000 in direct (unpaid overtime since we worked 50 hours on an average week and my contract said I would only get paid for 40) and indirect pay (no retirement contributions, paid time off, etc).

All because I didn't have children as leverage. It's been years and the difference between employees that have children and those that don't still bothers me.

In theory, absolutely yes. I do not believe free time or holidays are more inherently valuable to parents.

However… we live in a country/world where the vast majority of mothers cannot afford to NOT work, yet school is 9-3, term-time only.

Unless you’re lucky enough to have a retired grandparent who is happy & capable to look after the children, what is the alternative?

YANBU. My life is not less important because I don’t have children.

But what I don't understand is why people without kids would want to take holiday when the kids are off! I'd be avoiding it like the plague

Because our lives still happen in school holidays - mid week weddings, needing a morning off to take the car for its MOT, wanting to go away with friends/family who have children, that sort of thing.

I do mostly agree but I feel with children - with any caring responsibilities - there sometimes come clashed where there has to be give and take. For example, I will and do try to work my share of the Christmas period (office job) but DH has the kind of 24/7 shift work job and if he'd rota'd to work Christmas when there's no childcare available I'm screwed, and Will petty much beg for time off.

It never bothered me when I was child free. My folks both worked so I knew how much of a PITA it was to get childcare or be able to go to Nativity plays and the like.

No one ever asked me for my actual holiday entitlement though. That is cheeky in the extreme.

If it allows more women to stay in the workplace and not get priced out by childcare costs then I think its for the greater good. That being said, if its shift work and Christmas day that should definitely be taken in turns or that seems quite unfair.

Parents shouldn't get priority but hopefully one's colleagues might be generous if it doesn't matter to them regarding half terms and the summer. I don't really think Christmas is the same; most people want time off then if for no other reason than the way the bank holidays fall.

*I once had someone work for me like this, always getting in first and booking the best dates (including Christmas) on the first day the coming years holiday system opened.

He wasn't happy when I told him it didn't work like that and we had to be fair to everyone and allow people the same chance to take Christmas off.*

But surely that is how it works if you have a holiday system that ‘opens’ on a certain day? That’s the downside of a first come first served system, if you’re not the first to come you’re not the first served.

I think it should be allocated fairly and decently rather than FCFS - in my work we can mostly all be off at Christmas but we need one person working remotely on each of the non-bank holiday days (nothing proactive, just keeping an eye), and we generally just discuss our Christmas plans as a team and work out who can cover when. I’m one of the only ones with young children currently but I’m also on the management team, so I’d be first in line to volunteer to be on duty at Christmas because I get paid more/am more responsible for things being covered than my direct reports. Admittedly it’s easier with remote working, hopefully the new prevalence of that will help lots of people cover Christmas where they’d have struggled before. My other team member with young DC is Muslim but I don’t think she’s any keener to work at Christmas for that - it’s still the only time you get a decent cluster of bank holidays that might allow you to see family further afield and so on (also, she seems wildly excited for Christmas anyway! I think most people enjoy it as a secular celebration these days.)

YANBU

However as a single parent with no support, I work out when I need holiday at least a year in advance and book it before anyone else.

I hope none of my colleagues thinks I get preferential treatment, I really have already booked next Christmas eve.

We have an April first deadline for vacation/holiday requests. If you request the day by that date the requests are granted by order of seniority. Because we are a 24/7/365 operation Christmas and the other holidays must be staffed with at least a skeleton crew and it may take years to achieve the seniority to guarantee Christmas off. This may seem harsh but everyone knows the rules.

I always feel for the people that can’t have children that are made to work each Christmas ie Nurses. It’s one of the reasons why I changed career

Summer I agree first come first serve there are options available for childcare but Christmas is a different story.

There are zero childcare options available if you have no family nearby (which we dont). I am working 2 days between Xmas and New year on the 2 days that my DH isn't but it'd far from ideal and if I was a single parent then I wouldn't have this option.

Some parts of the country nurseries are open but none up my way are.

Sort of. But there are also times when childcare isn’t available and so someone has to look after the kids. We juggle it between us, but sometimes it has to be me. So I think YAB(a bit)U. Also - all of my annual leave is taken up dealing with the kids. I have no time to myself at all. It’s swings and roundabouts really!