Mom Sparks A Debate If Employees Should Be Treated Differently When It Comes To Time Off Depending On Whether They Have Kids Or Not

Don't know if you are in England but as soon as I wasn't tied to school holidays I loved it, June and most of July are generally better than late July and August in my opinion. Longer days for a kick off. Obviously awkward if your partner is a teacher.

I used to do rotas in my old job, staff needed 24 hrs a day 365 days a year. We couldn't let everyone have holidays at Christmas obviously but it normally worked out with:
1. Young staff were often willing to do a Christmas shift so they could have New Year off.
2. Orthodox staff would work Christmas and New Year so they could have a break for Orthodox Christmas.
3. Jewish staff would swap Hanukkah for Christmas.
4. Some staff who would be alone for Christmas/New Year would volunteer to work, maybe the money or maybe they didn't want to be home alone or maybe they were just being nice to other staff.
5. Some staff without children would volunteer to cover staff with young children.

I think in 20 years I had one Christmas where I got down to the last place for Christmas Day and had two staff who wanted it, we agreed one would work the morning and the other than afternoon so both got time with their families.

It was a mammoth task and obviously can only work if someone is prepared to take that on.

I had an issue around ten years ago - I didn't get any time off over Christmas but I had covered a few shifts for a colleague to help him out with Ramadan and Eid. He ended up having a few days off rota over Christmas and immediately offered to cover some of my shifts. Well, the murders it caused! He was called all sorts for not offering to cover a childed colleague, I was called all sorts for refusing to let this colleague have the free time instead of me. It's worth pointing out that my Dad was dying at the time! Moral of the story? Never give in and always do favours for colleagues of different religions.

YANBU. Childcare problems are for parents to sort, the onus isn’t on childfree colleagues to solve them.

Similarly, you can’t demand someone else sacrifice for you, ‘for the greater good’ (mentioned earlier in the thread).

Some jobs you can sell a certain number of your holiday days (think it was 5 a year) at a fixed rate to your colleagues. I thought that was quite a good idea.

As a parent myself finding childcare can be brutal, sometimes it's not as simple as pay a childminder/ holiday club as there aren't any so it's nice if employers show some flexibility.

I don't think first come first served is fair, we al know the people that jump on it otherwise, but a rota system of sorts, so I always made sure we took it in turns to work in the bit between Christmas, regardless of family circumstances (was quite easy to do in a low turnover environment, appreciate that might not work everywhere). That was a few years ago, thankfully it's not too much of an issue now though I offer to leave my work phone on if everyone is off

Morally, no I don’t think they should get priority. I do see why some employers allow it though.

For some parents, paying for childcare for most of the holidays would be impossible, they may even have to leave their job if it comes to it.

This mostly affects mothers and good employers want to support women returning to the office… it’s a difficult situation.

I don't think parents should get preferential treatment but I don't think it should be first come first served either.

We don't allow Christmas leave booking until Octoberber, and we ask everyone to submit their preferences. We have minimum safe numbers of staff so have to refuse some people. Who gets refused is based on who worked the previous year as some people want the full 2 weeks off every year and it's simply not equitable

Perks of working in a school! You are on the same schedule as your kids! Never have to work a holiday AND you get summer break, spring break, winter break, and here we even get fall break (separate from Thanksgiving break!).

Having children or not first come put your holidays in straight away dont moan if you cant have certain dates off especially xmas all know them dates when you dont put holiday dates in early simple

The school holidays are basically the whole summer, by the time schools go back in Sept, the nights are drawing in. DH always needed some time in summer because he was a cadet instructor and wanted to take other people's kids away, DF needed school holidays because he was married to a teacher...

The rules should apply equally to everyone IMO and no one person should get to book all their holidays until everyone has had the opportunity to book at least 2 weeks

I don't think it should be expected but I do think it's nice for colleagues to consider each other. Before I had kids I would leave Xmas eve for people who had young kids as I do think it's a special time of year for them, and you don't get many years of them being excited. Now I have young kids my colleagues have said I should get priority. I wouldn't kick off
if I didn't but I do really appreciate it.

So what are you childcare options then OP?

Do you have family to help, a healthy salary so that nursery or holiday club fees are manageable? Do you work full time or are you p/t or stay at home?

These things make a difference to our opinions don’t they.

Some people can fully afford childcare for the majority of the school years then lose their job, partner, health and circumstances change.

It’s very basic to say people should think of their childcare solutions before their have kids, without any consideration to the fact that circumstances can change significantly between trying for a baby and having a 12 year old with 6 weeks of holiday club to pay for.

All that said, I agree that it should be managed fairly so that parents and child free can take the holidays they want or need and no one gets to nab all the best leave every year.

But the blame doesn’t necessarily sit with the parents, it sits with the totally s***e attitude this country has towards childcare cost and options for working parents (let’s say women, bc the majority will fall to us let’s be honest)

As a parent who had only had the last 2 Xmas days off thanks to Covid and redundancy I do not understand the concept of parental preference!

But I agree. My DD works in the NHS and its her turn to have Xmas day off and got told "but as you havent got kids we put you on anway" and got no end of s**t when she said no.

As for summers off, well when my lot have all finally buggered off I shall do what my best friends do and sod off to somewhere hot in the winter for a month each year! Summer holidays are for those who have no choice imo

I worked in the care sector my whole life and only the last few years of it in a job that we closed for Christmas. We sadly don’t have children and yes I know Christmas is all about children however it’s unfair to expect those of us without children to always work Christmas. I always thought the fairest way was year about. 1 year you have Christmas off & the next year New Year.

I'm on the fence as well. Before DD was born I was happy to let parents and work colleagues who were married to teachers have first dibs on school holidays. Pre children we didn't want to holiday when the school children were off.

People don’t need to not have babies, they just need to organise and pay for childcare. It’s what most working parents do.

Yanbu. I say that as a parent.

I run several teams and we work it out between us. But there's no expectation that anyone has to not have leave because they don't have kids.

We have grandparent. Grandparents who live far away from their kids and grandkids and want to stay with them for a week. People with no kids that just want to enjoy the break and Christmas. People with no kids who will be travelling a long way to be with family. As well as parents

We are closed between Christmas and New year, so it's usually the days leading up to Christmas eve that's popular.

I took some last year. So am not this year. Luckily everyone on my teams seem to be really considerate of eachother and like to make sure it's fair.

That said, not at this job, but in my last one the only person who got arsey about having every Christmas off (we were open in between Christmas and New year) was someone without kids, as she wanted to go home for 2 weeks, every Christmas.

When she was told it had be granted to she could go for one, it's caused a huge amount of drama.

I'm a paramedic and the fairest system I've come across for summer holidays was
13 people on rota, 2 allowed off at any time, 6 weeks summer holiday, names would get drawn out of a hat, and assigned a week each, so one person each year would not get a week during the summer holidays. It then got put on the noticeboard for a period of time so that we could negotiate and do any swaps before being finalised. Generally if someone with kids landed the week outside the school holidays, someone without kids would swap (it's a tourist area, so being off in September is better if you don't have kids).

Sometime childfree staff would give up their week completely to a colleague with childcare issues, but there was never any pressure to do so. I think once a fair and transparent system is in place, staff are more inclined to help each other out.

Christmas on the other hand..... It's an annual battleground!!

I give single people priority at Christmas, as they often have to travel to stay with parents or siblings.

I don’t think parents should get preferential treatment but nor does first come first serve always seem fair.

I didn’t mind working Christmas Day etc when I didn’t have kids if somebody really wanted it off with their kids. I definitely prefer not working Christmas Day but if I am then I just get on with it and don’t assume I have any more right to be off than anyone else